darxus: (August 2013)
darxus ([personal profile] darxus) wrote2014-07-16 02:34 pm
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Eight years later, I'm still wondering what I could do for <user site="livejournal.com" user="nchant

The last, best advice I got, years ago, was to never speak to her again. So I continue to do that.

People who were close to us when we were together have said we were both abusive to each other. I expect I will always have difficulty wrapping my head around any part of that.

I wasn't a very compassionate person back then. I regret that I didn't treat her better. I've learned quite a lot since then.

Two years ago, I had four hours of BARCC training (active bystander, and first responder). In relation to that, I was one of the people who wore an advocate laminate the last two fireflies. I would say I was meaningfully involved in two men whose behavior was particularly problematic toward women (missing stairs) in the Boston burner community becoming far less involved in that community. I'm very happy to see people becoming more aware of these things, and trying to do something about it.

I'm interested in suggestions. You're welcome to speak freely.

[identity profile] darxus.livejournal.com 2014-07-16 06:35 pm (UTC)(link)
This was inspired by her post from yesterday, in which she mentioned me.

I have feelings about the main subject of her post (which wasn't me). I don't feel like saying much about that, other than that I agree with her basic point.
blk: (Default)

[personal profile] blk 2014-07-16 07:32 pm (UTC)(link)
I don't particularly know either of you. I don't know your history.

I have had my own share of being in relationships that were toxic in a variety of ways, some of which I can see now, some of which I still don't.

For one instance in which I feel I was abused, it took me 10 years to accept that it was such and to ask him to never contact me again. I suspect he doesn't think he did anything wrong, but he has respected my request. That, I believe, is the best thing he can do for me. Any further closure I have gotten on my own, by understanding myself, and by moving my life past it.

In other instances, I have been the one who was asked never to contact them again (explicitly or implicitly). It hurts. I want to explain myself, to apologize, to hear them out, to understand, to reconnect now that we have both grown up and matured. But again, I needed to accept that all the closure and healing I would ever get is fully contained in myself.

The best thing I can do for anybody I have hurt and also for myself is to continue to grow and improve. To learn compassion for others and for myself. To accept the past, both from my point of view and from theirs.

[identity profile] darxus.livejournal.com 2014-07-16 10:23 pm (UTC)(link)
Thank you.

[identity profile] zzbottom.livejournal.com 2014-07-16 11:12 pm (UTC)(link)
There are a couple of people I've dated in the past about whom I'm still rather fucked up. The reasons are irrelevant, but I am absolutely certain that them reaching out to me, no matter how altruistic their intentions, would still just fuck me up more. I suspect that nchanter feels much the same way about you. If you want for her to be better, distance is the kindest thing you can offer.

Telling my tale

[identity profile] sweetmmeblue.livejournal.com 2014-07-17 12:41 am (UTC)(link)
DrWex and I met because of a, now, ex-bf. He behaved badly. Not physically abusive levels but emotionally. After we broke up I had nothing to do with him but still held really stressed feelings. Three years ago I saw him at a con and kinda freaked out he was there. I was still ANGRY! I ignored him. Made a point of getting eye contact and then walking away. Over the intervening year before the next con I decided I wanted to be the bigger person and deal with my stuff and decided that if there were interactions I'd work on being ok with them. The first couple of comments between us were tense. But Saturday night he asked if we could talk. He sat down and apologized. He showed me how he'd changed and what led him to understand how he treated me was wrong. Last year we got to talk more normally and I feel that things are resolved. Had this happened before I'd gone to grad school, or before I made the decision I wanted to resolve all my trauma stuff I would not have been receptive to him.

There may come a time when you can have this resolution. However, it means waiting. Thank you for sharing your document. That's a lot to think about.

[identity profile] moonshadow.livejournal.com 2014-07-17 03:34 pm (UTC)(link)
I don't know how to put this without sounding either flippant or woo-woo about it.

The one thing you can always do? Send white light. (That's the woo-woo explanation.) Wish them well. (That's the flippant explanation.)

Your intention matters. I try, when I think of exes I have unresolved feelings about, at the end of thinking about them, to think or even say "I wish them well." If you can't do anything else, you can still do that.
blk: (delirium)

[personal profile] blk 2014-07-18 02:45 pm (UTC)(link)
I like this. Both versions. :)

[identity profile] moonshadow.livejournal.com 2014-07-18 03:34 pm (UTC)(link)
Thanks. What I do is somewhere in between those two things. Maybe... visualizing the person being well and happy, is a good way of describing it.
drwex: (Default)

Thank you for welcoming feedback

[personal profile] drwex 2014-07-17 04:01 pm (UTC)(link)
I think the only thing you can do is "nothing." Or rather, do what you seem to be trying to do, which is be a more aware, more compassionate, better version of yourself.

I've been reading on the topic of Restorative Justice (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Restorative_justice - Wikipedia link and you can follow references from there if you want) and I've come away with the idea that this can only work if all the participating parties agree to and want the process.

An injured party is not required to participate in this process (unlike a traditional mediation or criminal system). Sometimes they don't want to; sometimes it's not possible; sometimes it's not the right time, or not relevant, or not worthwhile. Those can be hard things to think about (for me, at least) but they're part of the RJ idea as I understand it.

Looking backward at my past self, I can see that I've been a right bastard to any number of people. Some of them have forgive me, some have not. Every year I find it useful to participate as fully as I can in the Jewish tradition of seeking out people whom I may have hurt in the past year and trying to understand how I can make reparations for those hurts. Some years I do better than others.

The way I learned the tradition, it's an obligation on me to make the first move, to apologize sincerely, and to try to undo or pay for the harm if I can. The other person is not required to accept any of those things, however. If they do not, it becomes a matter between them and G-d and all I can do is wait.

One of the reasons I've never been all that happy with people who seek "closure": usually that means "making the other person participate in my working out my issues" and that's kind of uncomfortable to me.

Re: Thank you for welcoming feedback

[identity profile] moonshadow.livejournal.com 2014-07-18 03:29 pm (UTC)(link)
Thanks for sharing the link about restorative justice. I found it both intellectually interesting and also personally relevant.
drwex: (Default)

Re: Thank you for welcoming feedback

[personal profile] drwex 2014-07-18 03:55 pm (UTC)(link)
You're welcome. If you find something interesting I hope you'll share it.